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On 30 March 2026 Secretary of State was interviewed by Al Jazeera's Hashem Ahelbarra: Secretary of State Marco Rubio with Hashem Ahelbarra of Al Jazeera, the full text of which follows below. Al Jazeera's website describes Mr. Ahelbarra this way:
"Hashem Ahelbarra is a roving Middle East correspondent for Al Jazeera English. He regularly reports from Afghanistan, Yemen and across the Gulf region. Hashem has covered many of the biggest international news stories in recent years and secured exclusive interviews with many of the major names in world news, including late Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, Afghan president Hamid Karzai and former Liberian president Charles Taylor."
The interview provided an opportunity to meet with a representative of a press organ that does not have a reputation for uncritical coverage of the Trump Administration, and which projects in important ways into the MENA regions in ways that Western legacy press organs and their instruments cannot do with the same trustworthiness. The transcript of that interview was also projected (in English and Chinese) into China through the US Embassy in Beijing. The English version was complete; the Chinese version was curated to foreground very specific elements of that interview (马尔科·卢比奥国务卿接受半岛电视台哈希姆·阿赫勒巴拉的采访[摘译] focusing on the Straits of Hormuz, NATO and the possible widening of operations by regional actors within the affected MENA region). The Chinese transcript also follows below.
The interview is interesting not just for its focus on the operations against Iran, but also on the nature of the US Israel joint operations (and their relative coordinated autonomy, and the situation in Venezuela and Cuba. Of particular interest ought to be the very very careful language about NATO and its future.
QUESTION: Do you believe the EU and NATO countries betrayed the U.S. at this crucial moment?
SECRETARY RUBIO: I think it was very disappointing. You have this – and again, look, the President and our country will have to reexamine all of this after this operation is over. But one of the reasons why NATO is beneficial to the United States is it gives us basing rights for contingencies. It allows us to station troops and aircraft and weapons in parts of the world that we wouldn’t normally have bases, and that includes in much of Europe. And to see that in a time of need – the United States has identified a grave risk to our national security and our national interest, and we needed to conduct this operation, and we have countries like Spain, a NATO member that we are pledged to defend, denying us the use of their airspace and bragging about it, denying us the use of our – of their bases. And there are other countries that have done that as well.
And so you ask yourself, “Well, what is in it for the United States?” And I’ve been a big supporter of NATO and one of the reasons why I’ve been a supporter of NATO is because I believe that these basing rights give us leverage and give us flexibility in operational capability all over the world. But if NATO is just about us defending Europe if they’re attacked but then denying us basing rights when we need them, that’s not a very good arrangement. That’s a hard one to stay engaged in and say this is good for the United States. So all of that is going to have to be reexamined. All of it’s going to have to be reexamined.
QUESTION: Let me start by asking you this: Have more talks begun with Iran, or are we still in direct communications exploring common ground?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, there’s messages and some direct talks going on between some inside of Iran and the United States, primarily through intermediaries, but there’s been some conversation. And I think the President always prefers diplomacy, always prefers an outcome, but we could have done this before. I mean, imagine an Iranian regime who, instead of spending billions of dollars supporting terrorist groups and building up all of these weapons, had invested that money into Iran, for the people of Iran, so they wouldn’t have water shortages, so their economies would provide opportunities for an incredible people. The people of Iran are incredible people, very resourceful, very entrepreneurial, but it’s their regime that’s been a problem.
And instead, they’ve chosen to spend the wealth of their country to support Hizballah, and Hamas, and Shia militias inside of Iraq, and to try to destabilize Syria when Assad was there, and all over the world to sponsor terrorist plots and build these drones and build these weapons to threaten their neighbors unnecessarily. So we would always welcome a scenario in which Iran was led by people that had a different view of the future and had a different view, and if that opportunity presents itself, we’re going to take it.
QUESTION: What are your main demands for Iran at this particular stage of the war —
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, Iran can never – the Iranian regime can never have nuclear weapons, and they need to stop sponsoring terrorism, and they need to stop building weapons that can threaten their neighbors. These short-range missiles that they’re launching, they only have one purpose, and that is to attack Saudi Arabia and the UAE and Qatar and Kuwait and Bahrain. That is the range of these weapons, and they have thousands of them. They’ve built extraordinary numbers of them. And not to mention, the – their desire to have this nuclear weapon to threaten and blackmail the world with, that will never be allowed to happen. It’s too great a risk.
QUESTION: What would you consider to be the minimum concession from Tehran to bring this conflict to an end?
SECRETARY RUBIO: I think they have to take demonstrable steps towards ending any ambition of having nuclear weapons. If what they want is nuclear energy, there are multiple countries in the region that have or will soon have nuclear energy, and they’re going to do it through a well-established mechanism that everyone else has agreed to, and that is that you allow imported fuel – you import the fuel or – and that fuel is used to power up your power grid and provide energy resources for your people. What they cannot have is a system that allows them to quickly weaponize it. They have to stop making all of these drones and all of these missiles. We saw recently where they lied. They said they didn’t have long-range missiles and then they fired two that extended well beyond the range of what their own foreign minister just a few days earlier said they didn’t have the range to reach.
So they have to abandon all these weapon programs and all their nuclear ambitions, and if they do that then Iran’s future can be bright. But they have to choose that path, and for 47 years they’ve refused that path.
QUESTION: Iran said it rejects the U.S. demands, and they set its own conditions, such as the financial compensation and also recognition of its sovereignty over the Strait of Hormuz. Are those demands acceptable from an American perspective?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, not only is the sovereignty over the Straits of Hormuz not acceptable to us, it won’t be acceptable to the world. No one in the world can accept it. Number one, it sets an incredible precedent. So this means that nations can now take over international waterways and claim them as their own. The United States could do that now, other – the Chinese could do it in the South China Sea. No one in the world is going to accept that, or should accept that.
Now, let me be frank. Very little of American energy comes through the Straits of Hormuz in terms of the energy we rely on, but we recognize the impact that it has on global markets and on our neighbors, especially our allies in the region who produce energy and have to get it out to market. So no country in the world should accept it, the regional countries in the world shouldn’t accept it, the United States will not accept that condition. It’s an illegal condition that they’re demanding. That’s just not going to happen.
QUESTION: As the U.S.-Israeli campaign continue, there’s not been any indication that the Strait of Hormuz is secure enough to restore the flow of oil and gas into global markets. Are you consider a plan to ensure full control over the entire straits?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, the Straits of Hormuz will be open. When this operation is over, it will be open, and it will be open one way or another. It will be open because Iran agrees to abide by international law and not block the commercial waterway, or a coalition of nations from around the world and the region, with the participation of the United States, will make sure that it’s open. But one way or the other, it’s going to be open.
But we have very clear objectives that we’re trying to achieve here. Those objectives are the destruction of their air force, which has been achieved; the destruction of their navy, which has largely been achieved; a significant reduction in the number of missile launchers that they have, which we’re well on our way to achieving; and we are going to destroy the factories that make those missiles and those drones that they are using to attack their neighbors and the United States and our presence in the region.
We will achieve those objectives. We are well on our way or ahead of schedule. We will achieve them in weeks, not months. And then we’ll be confronted with this issue of the Straits of Hormuz, and it’ll be up to Iran to decide. And if they choose to try to block the straits, then they will have to face real consequences, not just from the United States but from regional countries and from the world.
QUESTION: Your regional allies in the region, their critical energy installations are being bombed, their cities bombed almost on a daily basis. And they’re looking for a quick path back to stability. What would be your message to them?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, I think the best way to stability, given the people who are in charge in Iran, is to destroy the ability of Iran in the future to launch these missiles and these drones against their infrastructure and civilian populations. If you think about what they’ve struck in the region, what has Iran gone after? It’s been energy infrastructure against countries that were not waging war against them, but yet they went after these countries nonetheless. This is why they built these missiles and drones in the first place.
But they’ve also attacked embassies, diplomatic facilities, which is unheard of. They’ve attacked airports, which is unheard of. This is what they’ve done, and this is a weakened Iran. This is an Iran that’s weaker than it’s been in 10 years. Imagine five years from now or three years from now, when they had more missiles, more drones, what they would have been willing to do to their neighbors and to us. That was intolerable. That’s why this needed to be done now.
The United States is committed to finishing the job. We’re working very closely with all of our allies, work very closely in defensive – yes, unfortunately, drones and missiles get through from time to time, but the overwhelming majority of these launches are defeated. They’re shot down before they reach their intended target or the destruction would be far worse. These are strong, stable countries in the region. These are our allies; these are our friends. And we are going to continue to be there and support them as they face this onslaught. And by the way, they’re not the ones – Iran is targeting them in retribution, which tells you the nature of the people we’re dealing with, unfortunately.
QUESTION: But it seems that the Strait of Hormuz is not going to be the only focal point for you, because with the Houthis stepping in and firing missiles into Israel, Bab al-Mandeb and the Red Sea, could become issues that you would have to reconsider.
SECRETARY RUBIO: It could, and look, that’s been an ongoing issue. And when they did that, the United States took action against it as well, and many of our regional allies have had to do so in the past. It’s the desire, whether it’s the Houthis on one side or Iran on the other, to close these international waterways and create a toll road, where basically you have to ask for their permission in order to use them and get your products in and out of market. That’s unacceptable. It’s unacceptable to us, but it should be unacceptable to the world.
And I think it’s important, and I’m glad to see the effort Bahrain is leading in the United Nations, which we’ve been very supportive of, to get an international coalition that says we will not accept a world in where either the Iranians on one side or the Houthis on the other get to control international waterways and impede the free flow of goods from nation-states. That’s just not something we’re going to accept; neither should the world.
QUESTION: Do you have any issues with Mojtaba Khamenei staying in power once this is over and the IRGC continuing to play the crucial role it plays now?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, let me say, first of all, we don’t even know if he’s in power. I know they say he’s in power. No one has seen him; no one has heard from him. It’s very opaque right now. It’s not quite clear how decisions are being made inside of Iran. But our objectives here from the very beginning had nothing to do with the leadership. Would we love to see a difference – do we think the people of Iran deserve better leadership than what they’ve gotten from the clerical regime? One hundred percent. Would we be heartbroken if there was a change in leadership? Absolutely not. If there’s something we could do to facilitate that, would we be interested in participating? Of course.
But that was not the objective of this operation. The objective of this operation, which I outlined now and President outlined clearly on the first night, is the destruction of their air force, which we’ve achieved; the destruction of their navy, which we’ve largely achieved; the destruction of their factories, which we are well on our way to achieving, meaning factories that make these weapons; and significantly reducing the number of missile launchers that they have so they can’t continue to threaten their neighbors and America. Those were our objectives, that’s what we’re focused on, and that’s what we are well on our way towards achieving.
QUESTION: Are you fully aligned with the Israelis when it comes to the objectives at the end game?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, they have a different objective in terms of they are focused on the mid-range missiles in the northern part of Iran that target them. And obviously we coordinate and deconflict with them in terms of our operations. But what they are focused on is different. We’re not critical of it. Those things are threats to them. Those mid-range missiles that Iran launches that reach into Israel, those are threats that they’re facing. They’re also facing a threat from Hizballah, which they’re confronting as well.
So they have their own objectives. We deconflict so that our objectives and theirs don’t run into each other, but the President for the United States of America has established a very clear mission which we are executing on, and we will achieve our objectives in a matter of weeks.
QUESTION: Do you believe the EU and NATO countries betrayed the U.S. at this crucial moment?
SECRETARY RUBIO: I think it was very disappointing. You have this – and again, look, the President and our country will have to reexamine all of this after this operation is over. But one of the reasons why NATO is beneficial to the United States is it gives us basing rights for contingencies. It allows us to station troops and aircraft and weapons in parts of the world that we wouldn’t normally have bases, and that includes in much of Europe. And to see that in a time of need – the United States has identified a grave risk to our national security and our national interest, and we needed to conduct this operation, and we have countries like Spain, a NATO member that we are pledged to defend, denying us the use of their airspace and bragging about it, denying us the use of our – of their bases. And there are other countries that have done that as well.
And so you ask yourself, “Well, what is in it for the United States?” And I’ve been a big supporter of NATO and one of the reasons why I’ve been a supporter of NATO is because I believe that these basing rights give us leverage and give us flexibility in operational capability all over the world. But if NATO is just about us defending Europe if they’re attacked but then denying us basing rights when we need them, that’s not a very good arrangement. That’s a hard one to stay engaged in and say this is good for the United States. So all of that is going to have to be reexamined. All of it’s going to have to be reexamined.
QUESTION: I recently has spent some time in Europe, and basically what they say is that it’s the U.S. which is sending confusing messages to us, it’s the U.S. which is planning to disengage from Europe, it’s the U.S. which doesn’t seem to be really willing to team up with NATO when it comes to moving forward in Europe, and this explains the reason why we are being very cautious dealing with the Americans when it comes to the Strait of Hormuz in particular.
SECRETARY RUBIO: Well, if that’s someone in Europe told you, that person is very disingenuous because the United States has tens of thousands of troops stationed throughout that region, billions of dollars of weaponry staged throughout Europe – all of it there to defend Europe. Not to defend America. To defend Europe from attack. All over it. The United States is – without the United States, there is no NATO. I mean, everyone recognizes that, including NATO. If we decided tomorrow that we were going to remove our troops from Europe, that would be the end of NATO. So they know that. And that commitment – we haven’t moved troops out of NATO. So anyone who said that is not being honest, is not – I think they’re playing games.
At the end of the day it’s very simple. NATO is a Alliance, and an Alliance means it has to be mutually beneficial. It cannot be a one-way street. Let’s hope we can fix it. We’ll have time to address it after. Right now we’re focused on this operation.
QUESTION: Let’s move on to something else. I would like to talk to you about Venezuela after the capture of President Nicolás Maduro. Could you tell us more about your plans for Venezuela in the future?
SECRETARY RUBIO: I think it’s moving along very well. We said it from the very first day after that operation happened. I said our hope is, number one, to stabilize the country. We didn’t want to see civil war. We didn’t want to see systemic collapse. We didn’t want to see a mass migration event. You’ve seen none of these things.
What you’ve seen is that for the first time in decades, Venezuela is now selling their oil in the global market at full market price, and the money is coming back to Venezuela and being spent for the benefit of the Venezuelan people. It’s being spent to buy medical goods and equipment. It’s being spent to cover the salaries of teachers and police officers and civil servants and people that – sanitation workers and things of this nature. So it’s a very important part.
The second phase after the stabilization occurs or concurrent with the stabilization is a period of recovery in which you try to recover the elements of the country that allow it to prosper and grow, and that is attracting businesses back, creating the kind of stability that brings businesses back. We’re seeing that begin to happen. But you’re also seeing civil life come back to life. Independent media is now allowed to operate. Political prisoners have been released. Political parties are forming again. People are speaking and participating in public life.
And finally, you want to see a full transition, because in order for Venezuela to fulfill its economic potential it has to have a stable democratic government that people are willing to invest in that economy because they know that they’re protected by laws and courts and legitimacy.
So we are well on our way to achieving this. A lot of credit goes to the interim authorities who have assumed this responsibility. We’ve reopened our embassy. We enter in dialogue with them every single day. We feel very positive about it.
QUESTION: Many assume Washington will focus on Cuba next once the war is over in the Middle East. What kind of decisions or policy would you like to see in place for potential regime change?
SECRETARY RUBIO: Yeah, look, we don’t need anything from Cuba, to be honest with you. I mean, Cuba needs from us. We don’t need from Cuba. And what I mean by Cuba, I mean it’s their regime. The problem Cuba has, it’s a very fundamental problem and they need to understand it, and we’ve tried to explain it to anyone who will listen: Their system doesn’t work. Their system of economics, I can’t even describe it but it’s completely dysfunctional. It’s just not a real system, and you can’t change it unless you change the government.
As an example, a week ago they said, well, Cuban Americans can now invest on the island. Invest in what? Invest in a country that has arbitrary laws, no established system of courts and justice? Who’s going to invest in something like that.
You also can’t have economic prosperity without some significant level of political freedom. If I’m going to participate in the economic life of a country and I don’t like the regulations or the rules the government is putting in place that are hampering me, I have to have the ability to complain about that. And in that country you can’t complain about that or you’ll get put in jail.
So I think Cuba needs to make – and if Cuba really wants to emerge from the hole they’ve put themselves in, meaning the regime has put them in, they really need to undertake very serious reforms of both their government and of their economy. And if they’re willing to do so, we’re going to help them. We’ve done nothing punitive against the Cuban regime. They claim we have, but we haven’t. They only thing that’s changed for the Cuban regime is they’re not getting free Venezuelan oil anymore. They’re not getting subsidies anymore. That’s the only thing that’s changed.
These blackouts that are occurring that I seen people reporting have nothing to do with us. They were having blackouts last year. They’re having blackouts because they have equipment from the 1950s in their grid that they’ve never maintained and never upgraded because they’re incompetent. That’s why they’re having blackouts.
QUESTION: So I’ll end it — my last question, if you don’t mind. Do you have any sense of clarity about when the war is going to be over in the Middle East?
SECRETARY RUBIO: This – the operation in Iran?
QUESTION: Mm-hmm.
SECRETARY RUBIO: As soon as we achieve our objectives as I have outlined them repeatedly, and that is we’re going — we’ve destroyed their navy, we’ve destroyed their air force, we are well on our way to destroying the majority of their arms factories, and we’re well on our way to significantly degrading their missile launchers. When those objectives are achieved we will have achieved the purpose of this operation, and that’s something that’s not going to take months. That’s a matter of weeks. I’m not going to tell you exactly how many weeks, but a matter of weeks, not months.
QUESTION: Thank you very much. Thank you. Really appreciate your time. Thank you.
SECRETARY RUBIO: Thank you.
华盛顿哥伦比亚特区
2026年3月30日
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问： 在战争目前这个阶段，你们对伊朗的主要要求是什么——
卢比奥国务卿： 伊朗永远不能——伊朗政权永远不能获得核武器，他们必须停止资助恐怖主义，必须停止制造那些可能威胁其邻国的武器。他们正在发射的这些短程导弹只有一个用途，那就是攻击沙特阿拉伯、阿联酋、卡塔尔、科威特和巴林。这些武器的射程就是覆盖这些国家，而他们拥有成千上万枚。他们制造了惊人数量的武器。更不用说他们还企图拥有核武器，用来威胁及勒索全世界，这种情况绝不会被允许发生，风险太大了。
问：您认为德黑兰方面至少需要做出何种让步才能结束这场冲突？
卢比奥国务卿： 我认为他们必须采取可以被验证的具体步骤，来终结一切获取核武器的野心。如果他们想要的是核能，该地区有多个国家已经拥有或即将拥有核能，而且他们将通过一个大家都已同意的成熟机制来实现，即允许进口燃料——进口燃料，或者——用这种燃料来驱动电网，为人民提供能源。他们绝不能拥有一个能让他们迅速将其武器化的系统。他们必须停止制造所有这些无人机和所有这些导弹。我们最近刚刚看到他们在撒谎：他们说自己没有远程导弹，然后又发射了两枚，其射程远远超过几天前他们自己的外长亲口声称“达不到”的射程。
因此，他们必须放弃所有这些武器项目和所有核野心，若能做到这一点，伊朗的未来便会光明。但他们必须自己做出这种选择，而在过去47年里，他们一直拒绝走这条路。
问：伊朗表示拒绝美国的要求，并提出了自己的条件，比如经济赔偿，以及承认其对霍尔木兹海峡的主权。这些要求从美国的角度看是否可以接受？
卢比奥国务卿：所谓对霍尔木兹海峡的主权，不仅我们无法接受，全世界也都不会接受。世界上没有任何国家能够接受这一点。首先，这会开一个极其恶劣的先例。这意味着各国现在可以接管国际水道并将其据为己有。如果可以这样，美国也可能这么做，其他国家——比如中国——也可能在南中国海这样做。世界上没有国家会接受，或者应该接受这种做法。
坦率地说，就我们所依赖的能源而言，通过霍尔木兹海峡运输的美国能源占比极小，但我们很清楚这对全球市场以及我们的邻国——尤其是该地区那些能源生产国并必须通过这里把能源运往市场的盟友——造成的影响。因此，没有任何国家应该接受这种做法，该地区国家不应该接受，美国也不会接受这一条件。这是他们提出的一个非法条件。这种情况根本不可能发生。
问： 随着美以联合行动持续推进，目前还没有迹象表明霍尔木兹海峡的安全状况足以恢复向全球市场输送石油和天然气。你们是否在考虑一项计划，以确保对整个海峡实现完全控制？
卢比奥国务卿： 霍尔木兹海峡将会开放。当此次行动结束后，它就会开放，而且无论如何都会开放。它之所以开放，要么是因为伊朗同意遵守国际法，不再封锁商业水道；要么是因为一个由世界各国和地区国家组成、并有美国参与的联盟将确保其开放。无论如何，它终将开放。
与此同时，我们在这里要实现的目标非常明确。这些目标包括：摧毁他们的空军——这一点已经实现；摧毁他们的海军——这一点在很大程度上也已经实现；大幅减少他们所有的导弹发射装置数量——这一点我们正在顺利推进；我们还会摧毁那些生产导弹和无人机的工厂，而伊朗正是利用这些导弹和无人机来攻击其邻国以及美国和我们在该地区的存在。
我们将会实现这些目标。我们进展顺利，甚至超前于计划。我们将在几周内，而不是几个月内实现目标。之后我们将面对霍尔木兹海峡问题，届时就要由伊朗来做选择。如果他们选择封锁海峡，那么他们将不得不面对真正的后果，不仅来自美国，还来自该地区各国以及全世界。
（……）
问： 但看来霍尔木兹海峡不会是你们唯一关注的焦点，因为随着胡塞武装介入并对以色列发动导弹袭击，曼德海峡和红海也可能成为你们不得不重新审视的问题。
卢比奥国务卿：有这种可能，而且，这一直都是一个持续存在的问题。当他们那么做的时候，美国采取了行动，我们的许多地区盟友过去也不得不采取行动。这是他们的企图——无论是这边的胡塞武装，还是那边的伊朗——都在试图关闭这些国际水道，把它们变成收费通道——即必须征得他们的许可才能通行，才能将商品运进运出市场。这是不可接受的。对我们来说不可接受，对全世界来说也应该是不可接受的。
我认为这非常重要，也很高兴看到巴林在联合国主导的努力，我们对此给予了大力支持，目的是组建一个国际联盟，明确表明我们不会接受这样一个世界：其一侧的伊朗人或另一侧的胡塞武装得以控制国际水道，并阻碍各国商品的自由流动。我们不会接受这一点，世界也不应该接受。
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问：你认为欧盟和北约国家在这一关键时刻背叛了美国吗？
卢比奥国务卿：我认为这非常令人失望。你会看到这样一种情况——再强调一遍，总统和我们的国家将在这次行动结束后重新审视这一切。但北约对美国有益的原因之一，在于它赋予我们在突发情况下使用基地的权利。这使我们能够在通常没有基地的地区部署军队、飞机和武器，这也包括欧洲的大部分地区。而在危急时刻——美国已经明确认定存在对国家安全和国家利益的严重威胁，我们必须开展这次行动——我们却看到像西班牙这样的、一个我们承诺要保卫的北约成员国，拒绝让我们使用他们的领空，并以此炫耀，拒绝让我们使用他们的基地。其他一些国家也采取了类似做法。
于是你们就会问自己：“那这对美国有什么好处？”我一直是北约的坚定支持者，而我支持北约的原因之一，就是我相信这些基地权赋予了我们在全球各地的影响力以及行动能力上的灵活性。但如果北约只是意味着当欧洲受到攻击时由我们去保卫，而在我们需要时却拒绝提供基地权，那这就不是一个很好的安排。在这种情况下，很难继续参与其中并声称这对美国有利。因此，所有这些都必须重新审视。所有这些都必须重新审视。
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本译文仅供参考，只有英文原稿方可视为权威资料来源。
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